Chris Reece - Cannabis Meets Real Estate: The Investment Opportunity

What happens when you combine decades of investment management experience with the rapidly evolving cannabis industry? Chris Reece is Chairman and CEO of MJ REIT and co-founder of AC Capital Partners. He sits at the intersection of private real estate, alternative investments, and the state-legal cannabis industry. With more than 25 years of experience in asset management, helping raise over $10 billion at FS Investments, and a background spanning Vanguard and other major investment firms, Chris brings a unique perspective on alternative investment strategies. 

Discover how MJ REIT approaches commercial real estate through traditional first-lien mortgages and sale-leaseback transactions involving cannabis-related businesses. We’ll discuss how private real estate can complement traditional stock and bond portfolios, the opportunities and challenges of investing in an evolving industry, and what investors should understand before exploring specialized alternative investments. If you're interested in passive investing, portfolio diversification, and discovering opportunities beyond traditional real estate, this episode is for you! 

In this episode, you will be able to:

• Understand how specialized real estate lending can create investment opportunities in the cannabis industry.
• Discover how real estate funds can provide financing to cannabis-related businesses when traditional banks are less willing to lend.
• Learn how underwriting and evaluating property fundamentals can help manage risk in specialized real estate markets.
• Explore how diversified real estate loan portfolios can provide investors with exposure to multiple properties rather than a single deal.
• Understand how short-term real estate loans can generate income through monthly distributions and the repayment of principal.
• Learn how strategic partnerships and institutional capital can help expand a real estate lending fund’s reach and diversification.

The key moments in this episode are:

0:00 Welcome And Guest Setup

5:10 Why Cannabis Real Estate Is Local

7:51 Underwriting Rules That Prevent Defaults

14:31 Loan Exits And Schedule III Shift

18:53 Deal Flow Partners And Future Yield

21:11 Investor Concerns And The Ethics Debate

23:08 Running The Team And Managing Risk

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Full transcript here:

Chris Reece 

On the real estate side, that creates a barrier to entry, number one, because you can't have Philip Morse buy 100,000 acres in Nevada and ship across the country. So that creates a pocket of opportunity for the fund overall. And I would also say that even in a somewhat volatile credit market, we've had zero defaults in the portfolio.

Mike Swenson

Welcome to the Real Freedom Show where we inspire you to pursue your production to gain time and financial freedom through opportunities in real estate. I'm your host, Mike Swenson. Let's get some real freedom together. I'm your host, Mike Swenson. If you want to get started on your real estate journey, check out our website, freedom through realestate.com. It's where we put all of our content, all of our episodes with the goal that you can see something, hear a story, pick up on something that'll inspire you to take some action real estate. There's a lot of cool stuff happening, and we love highlighting different things that you can do inside of real estate. And today is no exception. So we've got an awesome guest today. We've got Chris Reese, chairman and CEO of MJ Reet, and he is going to talk about some alternative investing options in states where there's cannabis production and how that works. Quick backstory so their fund launched in September 22. So we've got four years going, 36 different addresses in 11 states, nine properties have gone full cycle, kind of like a mutual fund. And so we'll talk about the nuts and bolts of that. But we're excited to have Chris here and uh share. So thanks so much for coming on the show, Chris.

Chris Reece

Thanks, Mike. Great to be here and excited to share share with the audience some of the backstory and then also talk a little bit more about the broader macro environment that we're in today.

Mike Swenson

Absolutely. So give us a give us a little snapshot, a little bit about your background, how you got into things, and we'll take it from there.

Chris Reece

Just a quick background on me. Um, I have been in the institutional asset management space for uh 30 years now. Half of those were spent on the public side. So I got my start at a company called Vanguard. Uh, most of your listeners will probably be familiar with Vanguard and then moved over to uh Hartford Mutual Fund. So spent the first 15 on the public side. And what was interesting was back in the late 90s and early 2000s, uh, for the institutional clients, we built what we thought were well-diversified portfolios. And then the tech crash happened, and global correlations went to one, and the diversification that we thought we had went out the window. And that made me scratch my head and say there had to be a better way to create a portfolio that doesn't have the same volatility, uh, nor does it have the same uh correlation uh as some of the public's. So about 15 years ago, I transitioned and uh entered the private markets and was with the firm. We launched the first private business development company or BDC. Some of you uh listeners may be familiar with BDCs. Blackstone has a very large one today. Um, anyway, um, I looked at the BDCs and why they were successful. And it really was there was a high demand of capital and lack of capital to be provided to that space. So when I left and started MJ Reet, I looked at a number of different industries of where I could start a strategy that would be able to generate better risk adjusted returns. So I looked at oil and gas, precious metals, even crypto, and I kept coming back to the cannabis space as one of those areas of the US economy that happens to be one of the fastest growing subsectors. It's doing so without traditional access to banks. So if you owned a piece of real estate and you wanted to get a mortgage from JP Morgan and you have a cannabis tenant, you can't do it. Um, and then also there's limited institutional involvement. So I put these three characteristics together and launched MJ Really to fill a void in the markets to provide capital to uh commercial real estate, whereby that owner has a cannabis tenant and can't get a mortgage. And then secondarily, or equally as important, I should say, is generating a stable asset with above market income for our investors. And so for us, it's been a great journey. And really, it's been executing on a strategy that provides the much-needed capital so that the industry can continue to grow. And it's also important, Mike, to note that we're not lending directly to an operator. So we're not actually touching the plant. Um, all we're doing is financing a piece of commercial real estate. And that's important because it is a distinction that we're not actually touching. We're just simply owning or creating a mortgage on a on a piece of property.

Mike Swenson

Yeah, interesting. I mean, you obviously your background plays plays well into this because you you have a background, you've you've seen some things, and find an opportunity here to do something there where there's legitimate need. And, you know, that's what I love about the lending side of things is there's lots of opportunity there. You've got your traditional banks, you've got your traditional lenders, but there's all these different niches out there and spaces where people need money, people need help, and you're able to help them and provide great returns for people and pair A with B.

Chris Reece

Yeah, and it's interesting because if you look at the broader uh environment, so cannabis just as a as a going to the 40,000 square foot or 40,000 foot level, you know, cannabis is legal in 40 states, DC, and three US territories. And what's interesting about that is each one of those states that has a program, whether it be medical or what we call adult use, which is recreational, um, you can't cross state lines with cannabis. So any state that has a program needs to grow, process, and sell within that state. So on the real estate side, that creates a barrier to entry, number one, because you can't have Philip Morris buy 100,000 acres in Nevada and ship across the country. So that creates a pocket of opportunity for the fund overall. And I would also say that even in a somewhat volatile credit market, we've had zero defaults in the portfolio. And I really, you know, I really come back to the diligence that goes into every one of the deals that we put into the portfolio. And um, you know, this is interesting too, because we don't provide, and this is what sets us apart, Mike, is let's say you and I get together and we uh apply to Minnesota to cultivate cannabis. Um, we have to identify a piece of property and we find an industrial building, we buy that building for $2 million. Well, it's not out of the question that we may need to put six million into that property uh to retrofit it to cultivate cannabis. So think of irrigation, lighting, HVAC, high-tech security. So now in our mind, we bought that building for two and then we added six to it, so it's worth $8 million. And it may be worth $8 million to a cannabis cultivator, but to a standard industrial tenant, it's only worth $2 million. And so from the fun side, we would come in and look at that property and say, hey, listen, it's great that you guys put six million in, but in every deal, we assume that cannabis goes away. So the value that we would come up with on that property is two or maybe two and a quarter million. And then we would underwrite a short-term, uh, two to four years in nature, uh senior mortgage at 75% LTV. Now, even though we're not including the value uh of that six million of improvements, we will put that in the collateral package so that if we do need to replace that tenant, that six million of additional collateral is just additional icing for us to ensure that our investors get paid off. And so, because of that strict underwriting, you know, we do um we do pass on a number of deals. You think the building's worth seven, and I think it's worth two. Um, you want to borrow at eight, and I want to lend at 12. So we will, um we're not going to close every deal that we evaluate, but it's it's that strict underwriting underwriting guidelines that keeps us away from those frothier deals. And that's kept us away from defaults in the portfolio.

Mike Swenson

Now, just to clarify, because you had mentioned in that example the six million of improvements, so you guys don't lend on that piece. You're only lending on the property. So, how do they go about getting that six million dollars to fund the improvements that they need?

Chris Reece

Interesting. And so what I've seen in this space is let's say you and I were, you know, you're you're a doctor and I'm a lawyer and we're friends, and all of a sudden we're getting uh we have plenty of excess cash, and we say, hey, listen, this is a great opportunity for us to invest. And so a lot of it's self-funded. Um, and then what happens is let's say we we do this building, we buy it for two, we put six million in, and then we have a cultivation site. A year later, you come in and say, Chris, listen, why are we selling wholesale? We should apply for a dispensary license and be vertically integrated and then also sell retail and maximize our profits. And I look at you and I say, Mike, that's a great idea. But then we look at our balance sheet, uh personal balance sheet, and we're like, well, we have 8 million into this deal already. It would be nice if we could pull some equity out or get a mortgage on the property. And so that's when you would come to the fund. We would provide, let's say, a $1.5 million senior mortgage on the property. And then you and I would get that $1.5 million, which would allow us to go out and open up a couple of dispensaries and continue to grow the business. So long-winded answer is saying most of this is self-funded, um, either through equity. A lot of times it'll also be maybe friends or family that put money into it to um help acquire the original property, and then you want to pull some money out.

Mike Swenson

So this is kind of a step two in the process or kind of next level or scaling level allows them to be able to take those funds and apply it elsewhere.

Chris Reece

Yeah, or or conversely, let's say that you know you're you're buying a building and it's already retrofitted, and let's say it's four million dollars and you need a mortgage, but you can't go to JP Morgan. So you would come to us in anticipation of buying that building, we would underwrite it and then at closing provide you the funds to purchase that building up to a certain limit. So you would have you would still have to put your equity in, but we would act as the bank.

Mike Swenson

Now you'd mentioned 40 states. Obviously, laws are different in every state. Walking into this from your background, how how did you kind of figure out what you can and you can't do and and kind of know everything that you need to be able to be compliant and and be able to grow the business?

Chris Reece

Yeah, and that's interesting because this is all we do. And and to your point, every state has its own different set of rules and regulations, and you really need to know the underlying state. But for us, the way we approach it is while we understand the cannabis overlay, it's really whether or not we believe that if we need to re-tenant that property and we can strike a good valuation on the initial purchase or where we come out with a mortgage, that's really what we're focused on. And no different than what your listeners would do in a piece of commercial real estate where you're looking at the demographics of the surrounding area, how close a proximity to a major artery, uh, what's the the structure, what how old is the structure, what's the cement basing, does it have doors in the back, you know, what all those specifics. Um we'll we'll review all of that. But again, for us, it really comes down to understanding that this is just simply a piece of real estate. And we need to make sure that in the event we need to retenant that property, we're able to do so at an effective rate and ultimately um not take a loss if we had to retenant that at a lower price. And so that's been that's really been the name of the game for us. And in doing so and being in the investment management management space for so long, it's really been taking everything that I've learned from the both quite frankly, even on the public side and then also on the private investment side, and being able to apply that in a strategy that has the ability to generate um very attractive returns for investors.

Mike Swenson

You're somebody that uh, you know, when I interview people, sometimes career paths kind of you know bounce, bounce and flip all over yours. It it feels like it's built up to this, right? Yeah, you've you took what you learned, you're applying it and putting it in a different space. And so it feels like you're you're you're doing a great job, or your career path has just taken a very natural um evolution.

Chris Reece

Yeah, thank you. And it's it's funny going all the way back, you know, you might get a kick out of this. It's I think it was in when I was in fourth grade or fifth grade, um, we had career day and we were looking through the books, and I found stockbroker. And that, and that was really what I was like, wow, stockbroker, that sounds pretty cool. And that really got my um my my piqued my interest in finance. And I got both an undergraduate and graduate degree in finance, and then uh had this uh CFA charter holder as well, really just focused on analyzing investments um across the board.

Mike Swenson

So talk a little bit about being able to fund this then, how you were able to acquire the funds and and piece that together to be able to lend out on these properties.

Chris Reece

Yeah, and it's interesting. When I when I designed the structure of the fund overall, I wanted it to, I wanted as many investors to be able to access this space because we do provide good diversification, not only against other real estate assets in your portfolio, but also we many of us, many investors use us for a fixed income alternative. But as we you know, as we raise capital, the minimum investment is 25,000. Um, there's no lockup. This is not a syndication where you need to hold the strategy for five to seven years and hope that I exit at a profit. Um, although I will caveat that by saying, although we don't have a lockup, if you choose to redeem within the first 12 months, you exit at 95% of the uh calculated net asset value. So every month we we pay a monthly distribution, we have monthly purchases, monthly redemptions, and we value the fund on a monthly basis. And we launched at $25 a share. Today we are valued at $25.05. So we've checked that box of stability. And as I mentioned, we've exceeded that 10% uh target every month since we launched. And so for us, it's really just it's providing um our investors with an opportunity to diversify their real estate into a unique area of the broader real estate market. And by raising capital from accredited investors, we're able to deploy that capital into deals uh throughout the nation. And um as I mentioned with the holdings that we have in the portfolio, we're always looking to continue to allocate capital because those loans we have are two to four years. So they're they're constantly coming and maturing, then we get that capital back, and then we reallocate that capital to a new deal in the in the marketplace. But interestingly, I will also note that coming into the portfolio, it's not like you're buying a single deal. You're actually getting a diversified portfolio. So you're gaining access to all of those addresses, so you're not beholden to one single issue or risk that you might be in a in, let's say, a sim a typical syndication.

Mike Swenson

Now you had mentioned about typically doing a two to a four-year hold. So what you're saying then is at the end of that four-year lifecycle, they've fully paid off the loan that they have to you, and now they're they don't need a mortgage on the property.

Chris Reece

Yeah, and and generally what happens, there's a few ways we exit deals. So uh primarily what'll happen is the original borrower ends up selling the property because it's worth more and they're looking to just take some, take some uh, you know, get that capital back. So the first way we get paid off, which is the majority, is that we actually the property sells and we we we take our get our money back. So no different than if you sold your house, you repay the mortgage on your property. Um the other way is that let's say three years down the road after we do our deal, um, you come across another lender in the marketplace and you strike a deal with that lender to borrow at a lower rate. And then as part of that transaction, our loan gets repaid. Um, and then really there's two other ways. One is if the a private equity uh firm gets involved and part of that transaction, we we get paid out. Or the last one, which is what happened last week, is the company uh the tenant is successful and the tenant repays the borrowings out of free cash flow. And you know, it's it's interesting because even if you look at what's going on at the federal level, um, where there was some some chatter and President Trump who supports medical but does not support adult use, um, essentially it pushed the DEA to reevalue the classification of cannabis from a schedule one to a schedule three, which occurred. Now it's in the implementation phase, which from an operator standpoint is a big win because and this is crazy if you think about it. But if you and I, let's say we uh had a dispensary, well, um as a Schedule One narcotics, so before the change took place, we as a business can't deduct ordinary business expenses. And so our effective tax rate was north of 70 or 75 percent. So it's hard to be a new business in in any industry in the States. But if you think about one where you're paying 75% taxes, it's really hard. So now that that's gone, it's gonna help the overall industry be more profitable. And that's good for us because that allows more free cash flow to ultimately have our borrowers uh repay the the meet the interest and then repay the loan as well.

Mike Swenson

Going back here over the the the time of your growth these last four years, you started with just accredited investors kind of word of mouth, your connections, building that fund to start, started loaning it out full cycle. Obviously, you're getting paid back, and now you can redeploy that capital. And so that's that's essentially how you you've grown this fund over time. And then what are you looking for? Are you still taking more contributions um to continue to scale that to the next level?

Chris Reece

Yeah, and the the strategy overall is is really designed to be an evergreen strategy, so it'll be run uh into the future into perpetuity. Um, we're always looking for investors that uh wish to allocate. Uh it's the process is uh super easy, it's a docu-sign, digital, and then wire in the funds or drop a check in the mail. Um, unlike some of the other strategies, so we admit investors once per month, and that's on the first. So let's say today you say, hey, Chris, this is this is great. I want to uh put 25,000 in. Well, you complete the paperwork today or tomorrow, you wire in the funds, and then you begin to earn interest on October 1st. So the you know, the first day following uh the end of the month. So there's no delay in that. And then we pay our distributions by the 15th following month, then, because it takes a few weeks to collect the interest from a borrower, as it takes a little bit to uh calculate the update at net asset value. And then we either allow you to reinvest those um distributions into additional shares, unless you need the cash. Then if you need the cash, we uh set up a link with your bank account or we can mail a check to your your address of record. So it's completely flexible. Uh, most of our investors do take advantage of the dividend reinvestment program because you do get a 1% uh benefit. So you're reinvesting at 99% of the nav. So you get a 1% uh bonus. So most investors do take advantage of that. But again, it you know, ours our strategy is is you know, yes, we're in kind of a unique area of the market, but it really comes down to we just want to be that that stable asset that's in your portfolio that you're clipping a 10 plus percent annualized distribution every month. And you know, whether you take it or reinvest it, you get the opportunity to uh to oversee that.

Mike Swenson

In terms of finding your deals or finding your your property opportunities, what did you do to be able to build those relationships and find those connections to get started?

Chris Reece

Yeah, it's it's an interesting question because we're always looking for deals. So if your your listeners have any um one of two things. If they care to add this to their own personal portfolio, happy to have a conversation on that. If they or somebody they know um are they're looking for financing for a piece of real estate within the broader cannabis space, always happy to have that conversation. Um, I partnered at the launch with um a family office out of New York. They uh have about $3 billion in total assets. They manage two publicly traded non-cannabis REITs, and they have four institutional cannabis funds that are run parapassou with MJ Reit. So if there's, let's say there's a uh $5 million deal, let's say I have a million dollars of investable capital that I can allocate. So I would put in the million for the fund, and then they would simply call capital from the institutional funds to make up that difference of $4 million in this example. And that's allowed us to gain diversification right from the start. And I will also note that we are equal participants, meaning that there's no haircut or reduction in interest or additional fees that go into that. We are true partners. And we're deploying money into the marketplace anywhere between 12 to 15%. So that allows us ample opportunity to ensure that we're able to uh to meet our 10% target, um, which we have since every month since inception. I would also note that you know at some point this is this banks will come in at some point, whether that, excuse me, whether that's three years or five years or seven years. And at that point, instead of lending at 13, maybe we have to lend at eight. So we will see a compression in the yield that we can um earn in the market. But on the flip side, we have zero leverage in the portfolio. And if you look at some of the other large REITs, um, like Blackstone, for example, that's leverage three to one, uh, we could lever the portfolio at 0.5 or maybe one to one at this rate and still be able to comfortably meet our 10% target. So, yeah, we're prepared for it when it does happen. Um, right now it's a unique opportunity, a very timely opportunity for investors to clip above market income in a strategy that's designed to provide diversification across the board.

Mike Swenson

What's been your response or kind of the feedback from people in terms of the risk? Right? It's a it's a different space, probably a less a little less operating history that you could point to. Obviously, you feel strongly enough in it to move forward, but it seems like investors are accepting of that and and feel really comfortable with what they're where they're putting their money.

Chris Reece

Yeah, and the biggest, I guess the biggest I'll call it hurdle is um some people are just anti uh anti-cannabis, which there's nothing I could say. Maybe they have a moral obligation or moral issue with it, and there's nothing I can say that would persuade them differently. Um, I would note that if you look at um the scientific evidence behind the use of cannabis versus, let's say, alcohol, um, there's no medical benefit to alcohol, period. You know, it doesn't help you. Um, where you could look at cannabis for uh PTSD, anxiety, uh cancer treatments, etc. etc. And there is a there is a proven medical benefit. Um the other thing that I I bring up is again kind of going back to this idea that all we are we're we're a real estate fund. We just happen to be lending into an area that we can charge more because banks won't traffic in this area, at least not yet. And you keep it keep it that way. And and and ultimately if you really want to look at what we're doing, if you look at let's say you're on I don't know, let's say you're you're you're doing something on the roof um over the weekend, you're climbing up a ladder, you fall down, you ruptured a spleen or you do something and you hurt yourself and go to the doctor, most likely that doctor is going to prescribe some sort of opium opioid for you. And whether it's oxycotton or some other opioid, which has a high um high tendency for addiction and certainly does not do well for your body other than blocking pain. And so if you think about the opioid crisis that we have and if we can transition or maybe even not get somebody addicted to it, um, whether that's 10 or 100 or 1,000 or 10,000 people, that's that's something that I think has a has a value in today's society.

Mike Swenson

Now as you guys have grown, obviously you've hired uh other staff to be on your team. So talk about maybe a little bit about your role you know what is what does your role look like today in terms of how you're spending your time strategically to grow the company and to you know help grow up and grow a company as as well and and find great employees and train them and send them on their way as well. But what is it what does your day look like?

Chris Reece

Yeah and the staff staffing is always interesting too because it's always you know dealing with people um which this is a people business of course um you always have to take uh everybody with a a grain of salt and it's it's essentially surrounding yourself with people that are number one smarter than you and that are motivated in the same direction. And my role is really to encourage them and guide them to continue to push in this particular direction with the strategy that we outline. And my day generally is spent with staff meetings and then I also do I'm very involved with the underwriting process. So not only getting the updated financials on a periodic basis from all of our borrowers, but ensuring that the portfolio is positioned in the appropriate way. We have cash coming in every month I need to ensure that that cash gets matched up with deals in the marketplace so there's not a large cash drag on the portfolio. Looking at the yeah I oversee some of the accounting work we outsourced many of uh a lot of these tasks but accounting and taxation aspects so a meeting with our our teams on on those fronts on a uh weekly or monthly basis. So it's a lot of ensuring that everything is number one compliant, ensuring that the portfolio is doing what it's intended to do. If there's any oversight and and for example let's say there's a a deal that we're potentially looking to fund and we have a few other deals already in California um I may say hey listen we're we're kind of overweighted right now in the state so let's let's pass on this particular deal uh because of the kind of idiosyncratic risk that's involved in overweighting a particular state because uh diversification I'm a big proponent of whether that's in the states whether it's in the number of holdings uh the type of holdings as well so diversification across the board I feel is a is a valid component of what we do and so part of what my role is is to ensure that that diversification stays in place and we don't get overweighted um by accident, right? You want to always make sure you're aware of what's going on in the fund.

Mike Swenson

Are you looking to get started or scale in real estate investing but don't know your next step? Are you overwhelmed thinking about finding deals, analyzing deals doing due diligence and managing properties on top of it? Go ahead and push the easy button and invest with us. Real estate investing is what we do full time. We've done dozens of deals with hundreds of doors. We have the knowledge and experience to hand pick the best deals that most investors can't find. We've at large off market deals all the time where you can hopefully find returns and economies of scale that you just can't find on your own. The best thing is it's 100% passive to you for less capital than you put down trying to acquire a property on your own. Don't let this year go by where you don't make the leap, add to your portfolio or you just did an analysis by paralysis. To find out more visit freedomthroughrealestate com and click on invest. You can book a call and learn more there. So get to scaling your portfolio now with us by your side that's freedomthroughrealestate com and click on invest. You're you're driving the ship and controlling the speed and and where it's going.

Chris Reece

And I do put out uh we do put out uh for all of our investors we do a monthly uh distribution email announcing the distribution we do a um quarterly where I write a quarterly report on the portfolio outlining all the transactions that have occurred um all the payoffs that we've had over the last three months and then our general market outlook as we go forward into uh into the future um I host also a monthly webinar um for all of our investors as well so we we you know there are things that you can control and there are things that you can't um the easiest one to ensure um proper execution is controlling the communication aspect making sure that if somebody has a question or sends an email that you respond to that email um appropriately and that's what I instill upon everybody uh that works at the firm. So making sure that our communication with our investors or prospects um is is tight. Because ultimately listen we're not living in a fantasy at some point we're gonna have a position that goes sideways and and when that happens diversification comes into play. So we talked about that a little bit but really making sure that uh we communicate appropriately with our investors and also uh equally important is ensuring that we maximize our recoup and drive the portfolio to a positive outcome even with a potential default.

Mike Swenson

Awesome well Chris thank you so much for coming on and sharing we've we've learned a lot you got a great thing going for people that want to learn more and and obviously dig in in more detail and and learn about MJ Reet, how can they do that?

Chris Reece

Yeah thanks Mike so um our our website is MJ-Reet R E I T dot com. So I would encourage you to uh visit our website on there uh two things one is you have access to my calendar so if you want to schedule a call just to learn a little bit more um maybe we will work for your broader investment uh portfolio maybe it's not something but if you want to learn a little bit more go ahead and uh sign up there and then also we have a link on the webpage that you can uh sign up for a monthly distribution and we'll certainly uh send you some some uh info on the the strategy but it's also important to note that this is not you know this is not a spam um uh list like you you would provide your your name we send you one email a month um or if we do a deal we might send uh a press release out but it's it's not one that you're gonna be innovative with a bunch of emails that you don't want.

Mike Swenson

Fantastic well thanks Chris for for coming on and sharing we appreciate the time and and best of luck as you guys continue to grow.

Chris Reece

Thank you I appreciate it have a great time